A Price For You & A Price For Me?
By Stephen Cleary
Sunday 14th January, 2007 | 1358 words | Category: Steve's Column at The Nation | 33 feedbacks »

(The following blog was published 13 Jan at 'The Nation'. Here below, however, is the originally submitted un-edited version)
Once again, the ever wise authorities-in-charge have loudly proclaimed some kind of crackdown on double-pricing - and this time their target is restaurants knocking off Thai munchies at 500 baht a dish instead of the more politically correct – 80. So, how come that this kind of over-charging is deemed illegal, but over-charging for hotel rooms, jewelry, Thai boxing matches, zoos and especially national parks – is not?
It could be argued, that the prime epitome of double-pricing standards lies with the actual governing authorities themselves. The biggest complaint heard from foreigners about the two-tier price system, is without a doubt directed towards the land’s awesome national parks – who have incidentally, just bumped their entrance fees up yet again for both Thais and foreigners to 40 and 400 baht respectively.
Now, with such blatant legal double-pricing installed and practiced on a daily basis by the authorities – how can they morally proclaim a clampdown on some local restaurants which are just following in their footsteps? The authorities have been arguing their defense for donkeys’ years that foreign tourists are so filthy rich in comparison to the locals, that having to charge them ten times the price as locals - to swim in a waterfall, is completely justifiable. Compare that however, to the average scruffy banana-shake backpacker, who on having to fork out 400 baht, is bewildered by the sight of a successful Thai businessman, who - arriving in his latest top of the range Mercedes Benz is charged just 40.
And how about this for a Catch-22 situation: I read of a vacationing European, who took along to a national park; his wife and two teenage Eurasian sons – the latter of which could hardly speak a word of Thai. They were warmly welcomed by a couple of officials who were totally puzzled to how much to charge the family and especially the handsome half-castes. After much deep deliberation, the officers decided that the most plausible fee would be 400 baht for the Farang, 200 each for his sons and 40 for wifey. Even though the woman had been in Europe for 20 odd years, she was still categorized as a poor Thai.
Now, one splendidly clever notion seen throughout the land is the policy that two-tier entrance fees be boldly written up in English with Roman numerals for foreigners and, for the attention of the locals - in Thai with Thai numerals. Very innovative indeed, as every soul knows that most foreigners can’t spot the difference between written Thai and Double-dutch. Does a crafty policy like this, perhaps show that the brains behind it all are actually rather embarrassed about such double-pricing? I would advise such individuals, that should they care to charge foreigners ten times the price – they have the decency to allow them ‘to have the right to know’.
Let us have a look too at the Villages of the Long-necked Karen hill-tribe. Tourists have been informed for years that all proceeds from the expensive admission fee go to the villagers. Shiver-me-timbers, but if this were true, the Long-necked Karen would be holding their heads up high, living a life of luxury in spanking new mansions with attached swimming pools, while sipping imported wines and smoking big cigars.
Next however, let me explain to all the foreign readers who have fumed at the ears from being over-charged for Tom Yum Kung and Tour Guides -that Thai tourists also get over-charged and ripped-off. Any town’s person can tell you that when he’s on vacation in the chilly north or the sunny south, he too has to be wary of any costly inconsistencies. The local vendors in tourist areas which are also frequented by Thais, are even smarter than the park commissioners as they fully realize than many Thai-Chinese Bangkokians are as wealthy, if not wealthier than their foreign counterparts. In fact, most tourists or even long-term ex-pats don’t realize that there are times when tourists, and especially backpackers, end up paying less than the Thais.
Take the situation at a clothes’ market, your average Thai doesn’t have the face to barter the vendor down to the very last 5 baht possible. In contrast however, loadsa foreigners, after having studied their reputable guidebooks which explain the art of aggressive bargaining, are up in arms arguing the price for an astonishing half an hour. It is not Thai-style either, for the locals to try on a road-side vendor’s shirt before buying it first. Many foreigners on the other-hand however show no remorse, while the vendor’s back is turned, they whip off their tops and try the fresh garment out. The foreign tourist fails to gather however that his sweaty chest and armpits leave a lingering aroma. The vendor is therefore, forced to smell off the stinky shirt at a rock-bottom price as no local customer would touch it with a barge-pole.
It has to admitted, that a lot of foreigners are completely paranoid about being over-charged or ripped-off. During my years in the capital I don’t know just how many pitiful taxi-drivers I encountered who related some story of a foreigner who went roaring berserk after the driver had failed to know the quickest, shortest route back to his apartment. Jumping to the conclusion that he was literally being ‘taken for a ride’ bellows to the poor guy “Hey Scammer, open the door and let me out!” As for the driver, it’s a year or so later before he dares pick up another foreigner.
Then, I remember the scenario I witnessed a few years back, of a young European backpacker on Khao Sarn Road who threw a pathetic tantrum after the waitress had charged her 2 baht for a glass of ice. Absolutely livid when she was again informed that it was ‘restaurant policy’ smashed a glass on the floor before being almost arrested by the local boys-in-brown.

(Wanna see Nemo in Pattaya? Just thought i'd let ya know - the foreign company is gonna charge ya more than a local)
Going back to double-pricing - a lot of foreigners may be furious at how Thais can so blatantly and cunningly implement their two-tier price system but what they fail to realize is that many of their own kind also indulge in such practice. And an excellent place to witness this, is in Pattaya. Now, there is one world famous family entertainment venue there, founded by a man who calls himself something like…. Mr Ripley. And with a name like that, I can promise you he aint no Thai. Believe-it-or-not, this Farang owned center also has a two-tier price policy. And keeping up with the park’s commission, they also very smartly, draw up the prices for Thai nationals in Thai numerals. Then, there is another fancy foreign-managed place just down the road too, where you can see a few sharks, clownfish and also expect the very same double-pricing scenario going on.
And it’s not just some foreign-owned companies who love a bit of the Thai-style over-charging, there are plenty of foreign run guesthouses and restaurants scattered around the country who indulge in exactly the same business style. When a friend of mine confronted one a while back, he was politely informed that they had special prices just for the ‘local regulars’. I can only guess however, that most of the ‘not local regulars’ were in fact foreign or even Thai tourists. Some folk may also argue that this kind of ‘special locals price’ as is popular in Western countries, is just another variation of the two-tier price system
A couple of months ago, while vacationing up north, I too noticed quite obviously that some Farang-run Internet shops were also operating a two-tier price system. At one time, in desperate need of Internet connection, I was forced to give in and just cough up. Fortunately however, the ever-friendly Farang boss did offer me a free cup of coffee.
Related Blogs:
* Siam Ocean World Doubles Prices
* The Right to Choose
* Tourist Scams in Ayutthaya
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33 comments
Must say I have never noticed dual-pricing in the UK- beyond the "Half-price for pensioners- if accompanied by both parents and grandparents" joke notices, but I do not go to tourist places here.
Certainly I do not mind paying a bit more than the locals in Thailand-say double, but a 10 times price hike as demanded by the National Parks is a total rip off-with, seemingly with the blessing of the same government bureaucracy that spends so much money trying to get tourists to Thailand in the first place!
As a host, I offered to pay for his ticket. I remember paying two different prices--a much cheaper one for a Thai like myself, and another skyrocking one for a non-Thai like my boyfriend.
This is very true. Thai hosts often want to pay for their foreign visitors and this is when they often find out for the first time about the two price system.
Some places do compromise sometimes. I took one of our new teachers and her father to the Ancient City yesterday. She didn't have a work permit yet but I managed to persuade the ticket lady to give her the Thai price. And for her father she gave him the foreign child price.
In answer to Don's question, you can access Steve's blog by doing a back issues search - setting the year to 2007, the section to Opinion and searching for "Cleary"
Or, cut and paste the following:
http://www.nationmultimedia.com/search/page.news.php?clid=11&id=30024026
But the Grand Palace isn't run by the Thai government. It is run by the Royal Household Bureau.
They can do anything they want and charge anything they want.
If anybody even thinks about criticizing the conduct of the Royal Household, please remember that there is a law called "lèse majesté" and foreigners are not exempt from it.
No danger you'll be charged with anything then.
The main part censored in the article, which can be found here in the original - is the name Mr. Ripleys.
And as for Anon's comment - we at thai-blogs know the law. Thanks very much.
In fact, i just spent a splendid weekend at one of Thailand's most least visited national parks - and i got in for free. Will write a blog about it soon. But even the officials said 'I can't see it being fair, that foreigners have to pay ten times the price.
Another interesting aspect of this system is that in some cases the Thais have to pay more. I noticed this first when i wanted to take a coach from Bangkok to Surat Thani with my Thai girl friend. We were told that Thais were not allowed on the bus, since it was meant for tourists. The fare was cheaper than ordinary bus fares, since tousist buses were excempt from certain taxes. Thais had to take an ordinary bus, which cost more.
As a price-reduction for Thais, Steve has mentioned in the article that Western countries too have a locals price, which is similar to the two-tier price system.
I have heard reports from the papers of hotels giving discounts to foreigners but not Thais. That is really unfair.
It is also very unfair that Thais are banned from staying at many guesthouses like hose along Kao Sarn road.
Therefore, it only makes sense that government-funded tourist sites are cheaper for tax-payers than for banana-shake drinking free-riders.
This doesn't make it right, but as has been pointed out here and elsewhere, Thais tend to be practical about such things, and if they can find ways to get more out of tourists, they will do so. Another place where two-tier pricing was in effect, at least three years ago when I was last in Thailand, was for bus tickets. When I bought tickets from Bangkok to Korat, they were, as I recall, B187, but on the return trip, a Thai friend took our money and bought the tickets, and got them for B150 or so. Even 30 years ago, when I was there in the Peace Corps, an air-conditioned bus ticket from Khon Kaen to Bangkok was B80, except the last time when I made the reservation over the phone, speaking Thai, I got it for B65.
Bus fares are fixed prices no matter you are Thai or a foreigner.
There are different bus companies and they have different prices, so maybe on the return trip it was another company.
Also the ticket prices can change from day to day due to changing gas prices.
But there is no two-price system on bus fares.
We got away with the local price thing the first time we stayed there though cos I look Chinese Thai... ;p
will backfire on the government. Last
week I took ten of my Thai in-laws to
visit a waterfall down in Chantaburi. I
had to pay 400 baht, while they paid
the same amount between the ten of them.
Point is, I saw many, many farangs
refusing to pay the entrance fee and
turning back to wherever they came from.
Now if the fee was still 200 baht, they
prabably would have paid.
rather I hate charging period.
I have gotten out of having to
pay admission fees at some of the
country's famous temples by saying
that I had previously ordained in Burma
-- they're crazy about Burmese
meditation for some reason -- where I
spent 8 months fasting and reading
the dhamma and that I'm merely
continuing my spiritual practice by
visiting a Thai wat.
A complete lie but they eat it up
like ice-cream on a hot day! Twenty baht
in my pocket = score!
Charlie
"30% of my income is taken by the government for, among other things, the upkeep of National Parks, temples, and other key tourist attractions. A smaller part of my remaining income also subsidizes these tourist sites via sales taxes and municipal taxes.
Therefore, it only makes sense that government-funded tourist sites are cheaper for tax-payers than for banana-shake drinking free-riders."
Sorry, Khun Vichai, but your logic doesn't hold up to scrutiny. The price differentiation is not between taxpayers and tourists, it is between Thais and foreigners.
I have lived and worked in Thailand for 18 years, have a Thai family, can read, write and speak Thai, and also pay 30% of my wages to the Thai government. But because I have white skin I am always expected to pay the higher foreigner's price.
It has nothing to do with paying taxes, financial ability, or whether you are a tourist. It is the color of your skin, nothing more and nothing less.
If a Thai wants to argue that entrance fees for foreigners ought to higher - reasoning the payment of taxes, then, as Jonas mentioned earlier - Western countries too, have the right to charge Thais 10 times the price to enter the likes of Buckingham Palace.
One of Thailand's most well-known intellectuals, a critic and a Political Science Prof. at Chulalongkorn University 'Giles Unpakorn' wrote articles about overcharging to both The Nation and The Bangkok Post. Giles, the son of one of the country's most famous ever Student Activists the Late 'Pui Ungpkakorn' was married to a foreigner - making Giles a half-caste.
He wrote both articles about the Temple of Emerald Buddha guards who tried to have him pay the foreign price. He explained that he had a Thai ID card, Thai passport and had been paying taxes for the past 20 years. The guards would have nothing of it and tried to argue that he was still a 'Farang!'
That is beyond a doubt - discrimination.
All in all though, my article is not about discrimination and as a poster commented earlier, like Richard Barrow said in a previous blog 'You have the right to choose'. In a part of this article, i tried to suggest that "Yes, foreigners should have the right to know and..... so choose" But then, it would only be fair to give them that 'choice' and not post the Thai numerals thing.
Two-tier pricing! I protest!
But seriously, sometimes it is discrimination depending on who you get. Some guards are vehemently against "farangs" getting the Thai fee as the above anecdote relates, but some are more reasonable and will probably let you through paying the Thai price seeing as you pay taxes, can speak Thai, have lived in Thailand, etc.
If only the government were to have a coherent policy and not rely on individual judgments I'm sure you'd appreciate the fairness of it all. And, if the government were to be able to calculate the fare difference fairly, that is, not some ridiculous 10x difference ...
It is true that dual pricing is not properly implemented, but one cannot say that it is wrong at all levels.
"Some folk may also argue that this kind of 'special locals price' as is popular in Western countries, is just another variation of the two-tier price system"
In the case of national parks in Thailand, I would suggest to Khun Vichai that the average tourist spends in VAT during their two week vacation far more than average Thai person pays in taxes in a year. Just look at the average per capita income in Thailand and consider how few workers actually pay income tax - most pay only VAT through their small purchases. So your argument should go the other way - tourists should get in free because they pay more in taxes than the average Thai person.
Imagine af cry out if as in Pattaya where a farang is charged 400 for riden without af helmet and a Thai only has to pay two hundred. Can you imagine af cry out if trafic violations wes double prized the same way in europe?
It’s racism and nothing less. Though liberal forces have changed the very word into meaning something the white race is doing to other races.
It’s a slaves think’ and the very reason that they will never get out of poverty.
sonni08
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