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The Royal line is really confusing yet interesting, especially when you are a descendant of King Mongkut...thanks for sharing!
11/01/05 @ 14:40
How weird (not you, Oakmonster -or your illustrious ancestors !) At 01.00 GMT this morning I was beavering away on constructing and revising my new website, which includes a history of Siam/Thailand. The section I was working on? The Chakri dynasty. Rama VIIIth to be precise. Enough said.
It is very interesting to have contact with a descendant of King Mongkut, who I feel history has under rated. Without his preparatory work I don't think King Chulalongkorn would have been able to achieve as much as he did (this is not to detract from or criticise King Chulalongkorn's achievements in any way, given the problems he had with the Court and us British and the French)
Great explanation of Royal titles -I think you might find this blog linked, subject to your Royal Shortness having no objection !
11/01/05 @ 17:40
Comment from: Pi Email
http://www.kridakorn.org/html/page24.htm

Pictures of oakmonster's ancestors.
11/01/05 @ 18:23
Comment from: diego
Ghengis Khan has 16 million living decendants.

Beat that :)

11/02/05 @ 00:49
Royal Oak Tree!
11/02/05 @ 01:11
Comment from: amandarya
very interesting read!! its nice to know ur family roots :) thanks for the great post :D
11/02/05 @ 04:00
Comment from: Wit Email
Wow what a blog! Well worth the re-writting Oakley! One of my students let me borrow a book on Thailand recently from his High School library. It was also full of intricate (*PC* for confusing as heck) info on the history of the Chakri Kings and bloodlines.

Not the most easily understood topic but still an engrossing read, the same as with your blog! Bravo!

W.
11/02/05 @ 05:41
Comment from: Wit Email
Btw, loved the bit about the thrown shoe haha. Amelda Markos ain't got nothin' on you ;)

W., again
11/02/05 @ 05:42
Comment from: Jenny Email
Hi Oakley,

Wow. Firstly, it's cool you are a descendant of King Mongkut. Secondly, interesting about the history also although I got kind of lost in a way at first. 555
11/02/05 @ 16:27
Comment from: oakmonster · http://www.oakmonster.com
Thanks you guys for all the comments! I'd prefer to reply to each of you but I don't have enough time this week. (I'm stealing work time a la Wit's top ten list right now...hahahah!)

Just want to let y'all know, I intend to follow up with a mini-history of my family from both the royal side and my mother's common side, an extension of a paper I did in college.

Wit - No Emelda still has a whole lot on me. I'm a Converse/Nike/want to get a Caterpillar/Doc Martin kind of girl. ;-)

Trangam - Hey, I like that! Royal Oak Tree. Brandon calls me Princess Duck Feet. LOL.
11/03/05 @ 00:32
Comment from: Wit Email
'Princess Duck Feet' hahaha I like that, ah the endearing pet names that spell love!

Maybe it's karmic revenge but I am actually home sick today. Perfect time to have written my 'Top Ten' list but then where's the fun if your not being sneaky on the computer at work?

Looking forward to, as the late Paul Harvey used to say, 'the REST of the story' on your Royal heritage. Chaiyo!

W.
11/03/05 @ 01:04
Comment from: stevesuphan
Thanks for the insight as sadly there isn't that much info on this subject around.

A few years back i worked for a nice lady for a long time and when i just checked her namecard last night she is a 'Varavarn' and an M.R.

Now i can remeber at the time that i had a right funny young friend at the time, an artist, who was an M.L with a fancy 'na' ayutthaya surname. Even though he was not a 'Varavarn' he was a 'Kasemsarn'.

Then by sheer chance there was a friend of my who worked in the TV business who also had a 'Kasemsarn' surname. I queeried my artist buddie and my lady boss about their surname and both of them said that 'Kasemsarn' and 'Varavarn' were related.

In what way are they related?

I have noticed that even a few Farangs in the US hold the surname 'Kasemsarn'. Does this mean that even if the Kasemsarn or Varavarn girl gets married she still holds on to her surname and the man takes his wife's surname. This is legal in the States but illegal here in Thailand until just last year. So how have surnames like Varavarn and Kasemsarn etc... spread across even international borders at such a rate since the era of King Mongkut? Was there a law in Thailand that allowed married woman who on holding a royal surname keep it even after she was married?

One more question Oakie. If i were to marry (impossible now after last week!!) a girl holding 'na ayutthaya' or 'na chiang mai' etc.. after her surname would i as her husband also be entitled to a 'na' surname?? Or is this 'na' only passed down to 'her children'?? But then how could son have 'na' and 'dad' not?

If 'yes' to the husband taking a 'na' surname would a 'Farang' also be entitled to a 'na ayutthaya' surname even though he has no Thai blood??

And may i ask about you?? its a little personal you dont have to answer but did you keep your Varavarn surname after marriage or take your husband's? or does he now even though he is a Farang now have Varavarn as a surname.

I have been interested in this topic for years but i have found it difficult to get any real insight as most Thais themselves haven't the faintest. In fact i know more about the matter than most Thais as the subject interests me.

Thanks in advance. Stevesuphan
11/03/05 @ 15:39
Comment from: oakmonster · http://www.oakmonster.com
Hey Steve,

I can't answer all of the questions right now as I have to go home and consult my big geneology book. But a few items.

I should probably add this to my story as well. I am a Phromyothi, actually, before I got married and became a Boren, that is. My father takes on my grandfather's last name Phromyothi. I think when you are born, you have to put the father's last name down on the birth certificate.

My princess grandmother retained her royal title. Although we'd probably have to do research to get into more details, but I think anyone with a title (Serene Highness, M.R. or M.L.) get to retain their names. I asked that of my grandmother once, why she is not a Phromyothi, and she said because she was a princess.

With that said, the royal name only gets passed down through the father. So if your imaginary wife is a Na Ayuddhaya, your kids will still be a Suphan. :-)

I also don't think the law works the other way that you take on your wife's name. It's not really done that way. Bloodlines are passed through the male. Pretty much.

As for Kasemsarn and Varavarn being related, I have to consult the book at home, but I'm sure we're related because we're all descendants of King Mongkut.

*UPDATE* Confirm: Kasemsarn (and for some reason I keep thinking it's Kritikarn...but they too are related) and Varavarn are both descending from King Mongkut. Different Chao Chom Manda's (royal mothers).

Also, for other Farangs having the Thai name, and again, I have to consult the book, but I've seen a few prince and the descendents married foreigners. Of course, the sons take on the name, so that's probably how the names get out there.

*UPDATE* One of the Varavarn Serene Highness' had a foreigner wife, for example. So there you go.
11/04/05 @ 00:30
Comment from: bo
hello oakley

people always ask me about the line of the thorne in Thai kingdom. I am only can trace to 2 to the crown's prince and princess. Anyone can trace more than me.
btw what nomber you are on the throne?
12/05/05 @ 09:07
Comment from: oakmonster · http://www.oakmonster.com
Unless there's a freak accident very much like in the movie "King Ralph", you won't see this face on the throne of Thai kingdom. I'm wayyyy down the line and the royal blood is much diluted, my friend. :)
12/24/05 @ 05:11
Comment from: Setsuko Negami Ozawa
Hi, OakMonster, this is not a comment. Perhaps you could help me find a friend of mine from college. I have desperately been looking for one of Voravarn ladies who has been to US college, Goucher College in Towson, Maryland, between 1971 to 1974. I was there with her for a year, and we correspended for some time after my graduation from the college. Could you help locate her? As soon as I find her, I would like to visit her in Bangkok. Please contact me for more details.
08/13/06 @ 05:49
Comment from: tawhite Email
Hi Oakmonster,

I'm a great great great great grandson of Rama IV (also a great great grandson on Rama VI). So presumably we are very distantly related.
08/05/07 @ 01:27
Comment from: tawhite Email
Sorry correction, I mixed up the Kings. I'm a great great grandson of Rama V, which is nice to know when you go to a Thai restaurant and see his portrait. I think my Grandfather had an independent streak in him as he married a women that was not only a commoner but also French. Thanks for the article.
08/05/07 @ 01:55
Comment from: Peter
Hi,

I really like to know how you did your research.
01/02/10 @ 10:03

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